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Room Thief Shaming


Keely Kat

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To break this down, anything we build in game even though we thought of it in our head, Sex Game Devil can use if they choose to.  So you made a crazy awesome room, never even having anyone else see it as you're afraid someone would copy it and use it.  Sex Game Devil sees your room, decides to use it as a public room, you get pissed off but Sex Game Devil is going to point out to you they own all that is in the game even if you created it.

 

Legally they can do what they want in that aspect, but yes that would be morally screwed up and a shitty move.

 

This is a terrible analogy.

 

SexGameDevil does not need to hack their own game to convert a user room for use in a public location. If they did decide to do that, i am quite sure they would give credit to the people who built it. 

 

You seem to be unable to understand the root issue: 

 

People are hacking their game to make copies of other people's rooms which is very clearly against the ToS. They have come out and stated that they will allow this, yet they suspended a user for showing people how to do what they already said was acceptable. The action of stealing the room is acceptable but giving out the information on how to do that is a worse offense. It's truly the most backwards way of thinking I have seen here yet.

 

The only answer I have seen to this has been: "It's their game and they can do what they want". Ok then why have any rules at all? if you aren't even going to enforce the rules, how are we to know which ones are valid and which ones aren't?

 

This is going to affect them in the long run. maybe not now and maybe not next week, but it will affect them if they don't do anything about it. 

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The answer is... Gizmo has the power and ability to put something together so that this doesn't even happen in the 1st place. Yes you don't like the room ownership thread, it's not a perfect solution and I agree, but it's something! What we don't need is the constant reminder of how things are. I think what the OP is looking for is positive ideas instead of posts where we are all told what he already stated.

 

That's not accurate.  Anything you put online is accessible to some capacity there is nothing secure online no matter what is said, period.  I didn't say I didn't like it at any point in time, I said it's not the perfect solution as someone can copy a room post up the pictures to the thread and claim they made the room but they actually didn't so the person that did sees their room posted and complains.

 

His stance is that he does not care if the rooms are stolen, but he did suspend a user for showing how to steal the rooms. That means that the giving out information on how to perform an act is seen as worse than actually doing the act. Your reply to this has been something like: "It's his game and he can do what he wants". Well technically you are right, but that doesn't mean it's right. Some people like myself stand up and voice an opinion when we see something that doesn't seem right. Others sit by and just simply accept the way things are.

 

Gizmo did not give his personal view he gave the view as a company stance and what the company thought about it is.  There is a difference between using a hack to grab the file of another user's created room and then posting how to do it on a forum that rules clearly state you can't just as it does for the game, yet I've seen people post the .dll hack in WC.  That's where the problem is.  I asked the questions I did because there it's almost impossible to do as locating the source is difficult and very time consuming.  Not to mention the person can be using a VPN or other variable so it can be hard to narrow down. 

 

There has never been a single time in our history of this world when clear wrong doing is in effect and has turned out in a positive way by accepting the status quo.  It's morally wrong in this game and disrespectful to the creators of the rooms and nothing more.

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Guest Stefia

Jessica,

 

Technicly it isnt the first person has been suspended, when ive live atlantis steal, perhaps they had put 10 days to clean the subject of the masked but they have do too. And the masked hadnt develop how steal a roombut published the files steal in these forum.

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(starts grinding the sand within his teeth lol)

 

Guys if building is what you want to do and show off with then get. Go to Sansar. Your work will be 100% protected but don't try to turn a sex game into a builder engine. Seriously wake up. It's a SEX GAME! If you don't want sex go elsewhere. How hard is that to comprehend really?

 

I think you need to understand something.

 

What I do in 3dx and how I see this product and what I do with my time here is MY concern, not yours. You have no right to right to try and tell me or anyone else what this is and how it should be used. 3DX is different for everyone. We all use it in different ways and we all get something different from it. I can only feel sorry for you if you think 3dx is a "sex game" only. The "sex game" aspect got boring to me after being here for 30 days. The social aspect is what keeps me here. I don't expect you or anyone else to understand that, but in the same way, I will not try to tell you that you cannot make porno videos out of avatars and sex poses that all look the same. If that's your thing then knock yourself out. Just don't tell me what 3dx is or should be. I know what it is, just as you know what it is for you. 

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This is a terrible analogy.

 

SexGameDevil does not need to hack their own game to convert a user room for use in a public location. If they did decide to do that, i am quite sure they would give credit to the people who built it.

Hello, they don't need to hack it as they own the game and have access to all of our rooms that are on the server at any given point in time.  They may or may not if you remember FrenchTouch who did the dances and the backlash of bitching and complaining about them.

 

You seem to be unable to understand the root issue: 

I got the root issue, it's plain and clear what has been said by Gizmo.  We make a room open it public it's on us and we have to deal with it, period.  Bitching and complaining is about all we can do.  After a while they could turn around and say you don't have a room anymore and you only have the public rooms they offer.  Then everyone will bitch and complain again.  Get what I'm saying.

 

People are hacking their game to make copies of other people's rooms which is very clearly against the ToS. They have come out and stated that they will allow this, yet they suspended a user for showing people how to do what they already said was acceptable. The action of stealing the room is acceptable but giving out the information on how to do that is a worse offense. It's truly the most backwards way of thinking I have seen here yet.

While it's against the ToS to use hacks for the game, it's public on the internet anyone that is a part of the game even if an our, goes to all the rooms, copies then leaves.  What can you do about it as you don't know how it was accessed, who accessed the files to be able to do anything about it.  There is more than one way to do it. 

 

Gizmo Posted 17 January 2018 - 06:47 AM By saving your world on the game server, you must understand that it becomes public and available to all players. This means that your world can be downloaded, and also copied as any public information in the Internet. If you do not agree that your world can be accessible to other players, then do not create your worlds in the World Editor. Point out where in this statement does it state they find it acceptable, it's stating flat out this is going to happen as it does anywhere else.  By creating and making your room public you're accepting that can happen. A rule on the forum was violated and action was taken.  Again we agreed to that when creating a world and opening it public.

 

The only answer I have seen to this has been: "It's their game and they can do what they want". Ok then why have any rules at all? if you aren't even going to enforce the rules, how are we to know which ones are valid and which ones aren't?

I answered this above but there is almost no way to know is using a hack to copy rooms and who isn't.  There is no 100% secure anything that is online.  We have to accept that.

 

This is going to affect them in the long run. maybe not now and maybe not next week, but it will affect them if they don't do anything about it.

Again we agreed to that happening when we created a room and opened it public.

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There is a lot of false ideas constantly pushed here.

First, Gizmo never said that stealing rooms is OK.  He said that if you post your room on 3DXChat it becomes public.  The room information is downloaded across the internet and is available to anyone who knows how to construct the query to retrieve it.  That is the nature of how the game works and not something any easy fix can be made for.   It does not mean Gizmo condones theft, only that he recognizes the possibility and lets you know that you are at risk of having your work used by someone else.   The general rule on all websites even social media is that by uploading anything you are giving rights to what you upload to that site.  This prevents nuisance lawsuits by people blaming the site they uploaded to when others take what they made publicly available. 

 

I agree on most of what you said except for what has been quoted above.

 

This major issue here is that in order to copy a user's room, you must use third party programs and/or use the software in ways for which it was not intended to gain access to something that the framework of 3dx was not designed for. This labels that action as a hack, which is clearly against the ToS that was posted by the devs themselves.

 

If they want to hold a stance that user rooms are public info, then how can it be justified that a user was suspended by giving out the information on how to do this? 

 

They can't take the stance by accepting that room copying is acceptable but showing someone how to do it will get you suspended. The act of suspending someone for posting the hack clearly shows that the act of copying a room does go against the ToS. So my question is:  How is it worse to provide information on how to perform the act than to actually perform the act?

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This is a terrible analogy.

 

SexGameDevil does not need to hack their own game to convert a user room for use in a public location. If they did decide to do that, i am quite sure they would give credit to the people who built it.

Hello, they don't need to hack it as they own the game and have access to all of our rooms that are on the server at any given point in time.  They may or may not if you remember FrenchTouch who did the dances and the backlash of bitching and complaining about them.

 

You seem to be unable to understand the root issue: 

I got the root issue, it's plain and clear what has been said by Gizmo.  We make a room open it public it's on us and we have to deal with it, period.  Bitching and complaining is about all we can do.  After a while they could turn around and say you don't have a room anymore and you only have the public rooms they offer.  Then everyone will bitch and complain again.  Get what I'm saying.

 

People are hacking their game to make copies of other people's rooms which is very clearly against the ToS. They have come out and stated that they will allow this, yet they suspended a user for showing people how to do what they already said was acceptable. The action of stealing the room is acceptable but giving out the information on how to do that is a worse offense. It's truly the most backwards way of thinking I have seen here yet.

While it's against the ToS to use hacks for the game, it's public on the internet anyone that is a part of the game even if an our, goes to all the rooms, copies then leaves.  What can you do about it as you don't know how it was accessed, who accessed the files to be able to do anything about it.  There is more than one way to do it. 

 

Gizmo Posted 17 January 2018 - 06:47 AM By saving your world on the game server, you must understand that it becomes public and available to all players. This means that your world can be downloaded, and also copied as any public information in the Internet. If you do not agree that your world can be accessible to other players, then do not create your worlds in the World Editor. Point out where in this statement does it state they find it acceptable, it's stating flat out this is going to happen as it does anywhere else.  By creating and making your room public you're accepting that can happen. A rule on the forum was violated and action was taken.  Again we agreed to that when creating a world and opening it public.

 

The only answer I have seen to this has been: "It's their game and they can do what they want". Ok then why have any rules at all? if you aren't even going to enforce the rules, how are we to know which ones are valid and which ones aren't?

I answered this above but there is almost no way to know is using a hack to copy rooms and who isn't.  There is no 100% secure anything that is online.  We have to accept that.

 

This is going to affect them in the long run. maybe not now and maybe not next week, but it will affect them if they don't do anything about it.

Again we agreed to that happening when we created a room and opened it public.

 

 

I don't see a button in game that says: Copy this room

 

So ANY procedure in doing this is considered a hack and using the software in ways for which it was not intended to gain access to something that is not possible without using such hack. It's very simple logic. 

 

if someone copies a room, it is a hack, plain and simple. But don't you dare talk about that hack.. that will get you suspended. But using the hack... sure go ahead, we are too lazy to do anything about it. It takes too much time and costs too much to fix!

 

Yes we all know nothing is 100% secure, but it would not take much to implement even something that could watermark or ID a room to a certain user and then encrypt the data being sent. Will it be 100% successful in every instance? certainly not, but it would be easier to track who is doing it and it would also be better than doing absolutely nothing to try and protect the data. 

 

Repeating what Gizmo said over and over and telling everyone nothing will work is unacceptable to me. Sorry. I am not a conformist. When I see something happening that I think is not right, I will speak up about it, and this situation we have right here is not right. 

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I don't see a button in game that says: Copy this room

 

So ANY procedure in doing this is considered a hack and using the software in ways for which it was not intended to gain access to something that is not possible without using such hack. It's very simple logic. 

 

if someone copies a room, it is a hack, plain and simple. But don't you dare talk about that hack.. that will get you suspended. But using the hack... sure go ahead, we are too lazy to do anything about it. It takes too much time and costs too much to fix!

 

Yes we all know nothing is 100% secure, but it would not take much to implement even something that could watermark or ID a room to a certain user and then encrypt the data being sent. Will it be 100% successful in every instance? certainly not, but it would be easier to track who is doing it and it would also be better than doing absolutely nothing to try and protect the data. 

 

Repeating what Gizmo said over and over and telling everyone nothing will work is unacceptable to me. Sorry. I am not a conformist. When I see something happening that I think is not right, I will speak up about it, and this situation we have right here is not right. 

Gizmo Posted 17 January 2018 - 06:47 AM By saving your world on the game server, you must understand that it becomes public and available to all players. This means that your world can be downloaded, and also copied as any public information in the Internet. If you do not agree that your world can be accessible to other players, then do not create your worlds in the World Editor. Point out where in this statement does it state they find it acceptable, it's stating flat out this is going to happen as it does anywhere else.  By creating and making your room public you're accepting that can happen. A rule on the forum was violated and action was taken.  Again we agreed to that when creating a world and opening it public.

 

It's stating how to use a hack and giving a link for it that is against the rules, which we all agreed to.

 

While it's a hack used this is online and is subjected to it like any other site or anything that is online.

 

Do you see that part that I've enlarged the size of the text, it means WE the USERS ACCEPT IT period, end of story.  Don't accept it, don't open your room to the public.

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Gizmo Posted 17 January 2018 - 06:47 AM By saving your world on the game server, you must understand that it becomes public and available to all players. This means that your world can be downloaded, and also copied as any public information in the Internet. If you do not agree that your world can be accessible to other players, then do not create your worlds in the World Editor. Point out where in this statement does it state they find it acceptable, it's stating flat out this is going to happen as it does anywhere else.  By creating and making your room public you're accepting that can happen. A rule on the forum was violated and action was taken.  Again we agreed to that when creating a world and opening it public.

 

While it's a hack used this is online and is subjected to it like any other site or anything that is online.

 

Do you see that part that I've enlarged the size of the text, it means WE the USERS ACCEPT IT period, end of story.  Don't accept it, don't open your room to the public.

 

Oh yes I see it... you have posted it over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over. 

 

They clearly find it acceptable because they allow it. That is the very essence of accepting something, when you have the power to do something about it and choose not to. They punish someone who shows others how to do it, yet they freely allow anyone to do it. You can turn a blind eye and be accepting of this if you choose. Many others, myself included will not.

 

I honestly don't ever expect anything to get done about it. There's been bugs in the game for years that could have been fixed with simple code changes yet here we are 5 years later with the same bugs.  You are not going to change my mind on this. Maybe it's just time for us to agree to disagree. You are someone that accepts the way things are without question. I am not built this way. 

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Fuzzy logic, yah gotta love it.

 

There was no agreement made that created rooms could be taken by another user when anyone signed up. There simply isn't. There was an agreement between thos who signed up and Company.

 

Now, here is where the logic gets fuzzier, You can use hack tools to steal someones work and nothing will be done about it. However, if someone posts how to use that said tool, It becomes a sanctionable behavior.

 

The 'this is a Sex Game, this is a social game" will rage on forever. Just because it has sex animations makes it a sex game? By that logic you could argue it's really a dance game because it has dances that are used far more often, or that it's now a building game because of World Editor.

 

Personally, I think the reasons there is no desire too address the room theft issue is the company doesn't want the responsibility, as it would require hiring at least one or two World Ops to investigate complaints. The second reason being, they dont anticipate these issues to escalate outside of the game.

 

As room theft demonstrates hacked tools are used - and is clearly against their own rules, that is ignored. Their own rules against hacked tools that obviously are a personal attack against the creator, copyright rules, and their own rules against harrassment in all sorts of forms demands this issue be addressed.

 

Utherverse enforces theft issues, they will vigorously in their new Oasis you can be sure of that. This place can also.

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I think you could still open it for your friends just invite to your place. That way you KNOW who is there and should feel secure that no one you invited will steal your room.

Trust isn’t really something you can guarantee in 3DX. But Atleast this way you can weed through friends pretty quickly if your room ends up out there :P

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Oh yes I see it... you have posted it over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over. 

I haven't posted it over and over, I've referred to it.

 

They clearly find it acceptable because they allow it. That is the very essence of accepting something, when you have the power to do something about it and choose not to. They punish someone who shows others how to do it, yet they freely allow anyone to do it. You can turn a blind eye and be accepting of this if you choose. Many others, myself included will not.

This is online, there is no way to prevent it and as a company they know this as nothing is safe online.  We open a room public we accept that fact, it's that simple.  What could they do about it, as I stated before there are countless users who have posted in WC giving away others rooms and asking to PM them so they can send it, but they could have been given the room from someone else and them someone else and so it would be difficult to say who took the room.  That's because as we all agreed to the rules when we signed up and if broken we face the actions for it.  I'm not turning a blind eye to it and accepting it, I just know from a technical standpoint it's hard to prevent it from happening.  We all accepted that this could happen when putting our created rooms public.

 

I honestly don't ever expect anything to get done about it. There's been bugs in the game for years that could have been fixed with simple code changes yet here we are 5 years later with the same bugs.  You are not going to change my mind on this. Maybe it's just time for us to agree to disagree. You are someone that accepts the way things are without question. I am not built this way. 

I don't think anything will either.  There will always be bugs in anything.  I agree on that.  I didn't say I accept it, I said I understand it.

 

 

Adding this part for anyone to respond to:

I do recall there was someone in WC where one user accused another user of taking their room, so they went and took that user's room and was posting a link to it.  In the end, the person found out it wasn't that user that it was someone else apologized in WC but the damage was done. People had already downloaded that user's room and all because of a mistake.

 

As far as the difference with user created content in here and other games.  This game you're building in it with what they provide while others you're creating it outside of the game and uploading it into the game.

Edited by Mar Mohan
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I so agree. I have said for a long time that 3DX is different things to different people, it's not just one thing, it's many depending on how people want to use it. I personally call it a "Social Simulator" cause that covers everything.

I call it a social platform with adult themes. Lol

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Adding this part for anyone to respond to:

I do recall there was someone in WC where one user accused another user of taking their room, so they went and took that user's room and was posting a link to it. In the end, the person found out it wasn't that user that it was someone else apologized in WC but the damage was done. People had already downloaded that user's room and all because of a mistake.

 

As far as the difference with user created content in here and other games. This game you're building in it with what they provide while others you're creating it outside of the game and uploading it into the game.

That isn't the only scenario for protection.

 

In game made properties in RLC created with Utherverse props are protected as user created and owned. Only the subscriber has ownership and UV has limited rights (they need rights in order to rebroadcast or none would see the creations). As are those using free comercial or paid for textures off the internet, as well as custom.

 

What is going on here is simply bad for the product in addition to violating their own rules on the most basic of levels. Unfortunately, when a competator comes along that is as good or better, and addresses these issues, the policy here will harm the product.

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I'm sorry but to simply say there's no way to protect against it is laughable and very lazy at best. Just making a statement like this says a lot about one's personality and views. ALL other companies find ways to do it. Anything at this point would be better than nothing.  I'm also tired of people circling the issues and dodging the obvious problems by posting things we already know about.

 

For the 1000000000th time.. Yes we know what Gizmo said. We don't need it "referred to" over and over.  

 

There's no reason 3DX can't make an effort. Paying users are creating content and increasing the value of their product for FREE. There's no logical reason why they can't do something to protect these people's creations. 

 

Yes we all know they can do what they want. (or attempt to at least)

 

Yes we all know Gizmo has given his stance (many millions of times over)

 

Yes we all know nothing on the internet is always 100% secure. 

 

Yes we all know there will always be bugs in everything (wait what?  where did this come from? where did this idea come from that everything has bugs in it? That is simply not true at all)

 

None of the above changes the fact that what is happening is plain and simple.. WRONG. Most companies would attempt do something about it to protect their users who are actually creating this content, which is very high quality and enjoyed by all users, at zero cost to the development team!

 

You will never in a million years convince me or anyone else that there is no way to fix this. That's called being lazy and close minded. It is not the norm in any online social world, it is not right, and it's something that I feel should be addressed in one way or another. 

 

On the ideas of others, I have created a thread to try and make a difference and/or maybe take a step in the right direction, TRYING to do something or anything. I was met with ridicule and negativity by the same few people who scour these threads daily to try and tell everyone: That idea wont work, that idea is dumb, you should do this instead, you should play like this, you should just accept things for how they are. I have already given my points on such topics. I don't feel the need to have to apologize for it, but I am not a sheep conformist that accepts things as they are without question, especially when they are detrimental to so many people in so many ways. 

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There is no way to say they haven't or aren't. Like Target, Home Depot and TD bank they all put measures in place to prevent the hack they were affected by but that's all they can to as it's not 100%. That's the part we need to understand and accept.

 

I didn't ridicule you, I said it was a good idea, flawed yes even you agreed to that.  I tell people to play the game for themselves and have some fun.  I don't need to tell someone what to think, do or how to play a game.  I simply comment with my opinion like everyone else.

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All i know is the guy who made the game says its a sex game. Doesnt mean you have to treat it as such but that still doesnt change the fact it is.

 

You could rp star trek in a star wars game, still a star wars game .

 

 

Saying that someone else said something to promote your argument carries no merit whatsoever.  Giving users abilities within the game that are not sex related makes it something other than a sex game.   Your opinion has no bearing on what something is or what it becomes other than to yourself.

Your choice to keep your life shallow and limited has no bearing on how we choose to experience our world.

If I use a rock to hammer nails then that rock is my hammer despite what name you choose to give it.  I would not even call this a social game/platform because that is not what everyone uses it for.  It is a game with potential to become different things to different people and no obligations upon them to behave how you think is appropriate based on your own personal bias or lack of comprehension.

 

You are not an unintelligent person, I see you post many insightful things.  Your stubborn insistence to argue a meaningless point about what the game is when obviously it is something very different indicates you either want to irritate people to entertain yourself or you have a tremendous lack of depth to your thinking and inability to understand more fluid concepts leaving you stuck supporting strict definitions that never change even though the subject matter does.

 

By your definition I do not play the game because I have not had sex in the game in over 8 months though I am still logged into the game just about every day building something interesting, having conversations both good and bad and generally making people laugh.   My game has sex options but is not a sex game.   Too bad yours is so limited.

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Saying that someone else said something to promote your argument carries no merit whatsoever.  Giving users abilities within the game that are not sex related makes it something other than a sex game.   Your opinion has no bearing on what something is or what it becomes other than to yourself.

Your choice to keep your life shallow and limited has no bearing on how we choose to experience our world.

If I use a rock to hammer nails then that rock is my hammer despite what name you choose to give it.  I would not even call this a social game/platform because that is not what everyone uses it for.  It is a game with potential to become different things to different people and no obligations upon them to behave how you think is appropriate based on your own personal bias or lack of comprehension.

 

You are not an unintelligent person, I see you post many insightful things.  Your stubborn insistence to argue a meaningless point about what the game is when obviously it is something very different indicates you either want to irritate people to entertain yourself or you have a tremendous lack of depth to your thinking and inability to understand more fluid concepts leaving you stuck supporting strict definitions that never change even though the subject matter does.

 

By your definition I do not play the game because I have not had sex in the game in over 8 months though I am still logged into the game just about every day building something interesting, having conversations both good and bad and generally making people laugh.   My game has sex options but is not a sex game.   Too bad yours is so limited.

 

 

he is a troll... don't expect more.

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Are you going to cry? You guys are really taking people copying rooms in a sex game far too serious. You would think your house was broken into or your dog was stolen. Lighten up, its a game. All that stress is bad for you

 

and yet you spend all your time talking shit on the games forum..... u keep talking about people getting stressed or upset about it and yet here you are all the time commenting. on something that's just a game according to u. no robert, it means more to you..... way more. you'd be lost without it ;) Its why you keep coming back after rage quitting. empty mind, empty life

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I didn't ridicule you, I said it was a good idea, flawed yes even you agreed to that.  I tell people to play the game for themselves and have some fun.  I don't need to tell someone what to think, do or how to play a game.  I simply comment with my opinion like everyone else.

 

 

I didn't say you did.

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Ohhh, the Deja vú ~

 

So, are we going to take a step forwards, or...?

 

Oh Llavia, it is so against the nature of the average person to take steps forward.   Staying mired in the here and now is so less frightening.

Seriously though, no I do not think things will take a step forward.  The thread is bogged down by those who are too emotionally involved and not thinking realistically or those who just want to interfere for personal pleasure.

There is much I want to say but it is wasted effort in a forum where both the victims and the trolls will twist the truth to support their arguments rather than dealing with the problem in any rational way.  It may as well be politics as there is bull flowing freely from both sides and the victims are quickly losing any moral high ground.  Nobody wants to see/hear the truth, they want someone to tell them they are right regardless of their actions.   

It's all just drama now and as wrong as it is for someone to have their work taken and claimed by someone else, I cannot continue to feel sorry for them when they themselves become the wrongdoers propagating false information or working to help others become room thieves.

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