Allowing players to moderate their own in-game rooms and in-Forum topics

[Briana]

...I cannot help your butt hurt, i only hope that one day you can move on from it. take up sewing or something , it calms the nerves. maybe even bingo

Or this?

[Desirea]

[Twiggy]

The 50% of the potential market Ciera mentions is clearly talking about women being that 50%, and you come back with this...

 

because well over 50 percent have no friggen clue what they want. all you have to do is go thread to thread, they just like to bitch and moan, there is a reason they largely get ignored. first its about no updates, then its about what they didnt get in the update, then its about the update being glitchy. etc, etc, etc. If you have a problem with the fact they dont listen to you, there is a way to fix that. i think you know what that is. 

 

I find it funny you mention random drivel, thats all that you are doing. I cannot help your butt hurt, i only hope that one day you can move on from it. take up sewing or something , it calms the nerves. maybe even bingo

 

Do you have any idea how incredibly sexist that is, again you show your true colours.

[Guest Ciera]

I wasn't going to post again just yet but maybe I should start trying to bring things back on track.

 

A few facts - women, averaged world wide, have a greater disposable income than ever before.

 

In the UK male average income is falling, womens' average income is increasing despite the wierdnesses of the UK economy.

 

In the UK women are leaving men far behind in education and are making significant inroads in to most professions

 

In short - ignore the market at your peril.

 

On a slightly different tack - $19.99 a month, $59.99 for six months and $91.99 a year is a lot of money to pay for awful conversation, pathetic attempts at sex and to be expected to be grateful when some wanker blows his load over you. It is a lot of money to be told to fuck off when you politely say no because you're chatting with friends. In forums it's a lot of money to have to tolerate abuse, ridicule and the sort of blatant sexism that went out in the 1960's.

 

What is intriguing is that these displays of sexism are from people who live in the western world and really should know better.

 

The above really does not look like money well spent.

 

To step away from the related gender issues for a minute - in due course people will start leaving 3dx. A better product will appear in due course. Thinking it is OK to abuse and belittle people, whateer their gender, in game and in the forums can only hasten this happenning.

 

So RobT and Co. ask yourselves what you are doing to promote the devs best interests. This thread is about what you have been doing to other people's threads, the net result of it is that they'll walk. Maybe not now, maybe not tomorrow but someday they will. Failing to address that is complacency - how many large businesses have we seen fail because of complacency. Just think what it's like for a relatively small one in a vey competitive marketplace.

[Guest Ciera]

Once again he takes absolutely no notice of what people actually say. Going off on his own little tangent, thinking he's being clever.

 

Arrogance and complacency go hand in hand.

[Guest Ciera]

I suppose this time he has taken a little notice of what I've said. Once again, though, he makes himself look a complete idiot.

 

It's clear that he wants to trash Sagie's thread because he doesn't like the idea that he'd be sidelined if it happenned. The trouble is that this sort of behaviour will convince anybody that there is a need for effective moderation, or self moderation in 3dx as a whole. The devs will take effective action if they think their business model is being jeopardised by poor in game and forum behaviour. They may be turning a blind eye at present but that cannot go on for ever, for the very reasons I've outlined.

 

You don't need an MBA from a posh university to see what is simpley common sense.

[Desirea]

Trolling with memes is lame. You all can do better, I have faith in you.

[Sage Stoner]

Once again he takes absolutely no notice of what people actually say. Going off on his own little tangent, thinking he's being clever.

 

 

Yes, that is often what happens in this forum when someone realizes that they can't "win" with just the substance of their argument. Instead of acknowledging the valid parts of their opponent's point of view, they belittle. And if that doesn't work, they trash the thread with memes.

 

Just stay on topic, C, and let him show his true colors.  

[Sage Stoner]

Nice come back. If you were 10 years old, that is. As Desirea says, you can do better. Why don't you try?

[Sage Stoner]

*yawns*  You say something, Master Robbie?

[Guest Mulan]

I wasn't going to post again just yet but maybe I should start trying to bring things back on track.

 

A few facts - women, averaged world wide, have a greater disposable income than ever before.

 

In the UK male average income is falling, womens' average income is increasing despite the wierdnesses of the UK economy.

 

In the UK women are leaving men far behind in education and are making significant inroads in to most professions

 

In short - ignore the market at your peril.

 

On a slightly different tack - $19.99 a month, $59.99 for six months and $91.99 a year is a lot of money to pay for awful conversation, pathetic attempts at sex and to be expected to be grateful when some wanker blows his load over you. It is a lot of money to be told to fuck off when you politely say no because you're chatting with friends. In forums it's a lot of money to have to tolerate abuse, ridicule and the sort of blatant sexism that went out in the 1960's.

 

What is intriguing is that these displays of sexism are from people who live in the western world and really should know better.

 

The above really does not look like money well spent.

 

To step away from the related gender issues for a minute - in due course people will start leaving 3dx. A better product will appear in due course. Thinking it is OK to abuse and belittle people, whateer their gender, in game and in the forums can only hasten this happenning.

 

So RobT and Co. ask yourselves what you are doing to promote the devs best interests. This thread is about what you have been doing to other people's threads, the net result of it is that they'll walk. Maybe not now, maybe not tomorrow but someday they will. Failing to address that is complacency - how many large businesses have we seen fail because of complacency. Just think what it's like for a relatively small one in a vey competitive marketplace.

Those facts you list are going against the feminist narrative that there is a white male patriarchy holding them back. Yes women are having increasing incomes, more women are graduating from universities in higher rates than ever before. Women of the west are one of the most privileged classes of people in history. Safer, higher incomes, highly educated. Yet you continue to bang the drum that women still get the short end of the stick.

 

While equality is great, putting on my conservative hat, the result of more women becoming more career focused and more of a move towards secularism has led to demise of the traditional nuclear family. In the UK we have an aging population which puts more of a burden on services like the NHS. We then rely heavily on immigration in order to fill the shortfall in the health service. I have two problems with this. First we are removing highly skilled workers from countries that need those workers. Second, less people are having children and families. Look at Japan for example, who have an aging population, low birth rates, and strict on immigration, which leads to having the highest ratio of debt to GDP.

 

 

What are you trying to say? People asking for sex in a sex game is somehow sexist? Whatever next? Asking for a banana in a greengrocer is sexist (that is sarcasm)?

 

People have threatened to leave 3DX since the fall of the Berlin Wall, yet people continue to stay and the game continues to grow, so you can hardly blame the devs for not taking people who complain about everything seriously.

[TheDonald]

TOLD MYSELF I WOULDN'T POST ON THIS TOPIC AND I SEE MY PROBLEM WHEN I ENABLE THE EMAIL NOTICE THINGY.  I OVER LOOKED THE FACT THAT I DONT REALLY PAY ATTENTION TO THE FORUMS MUCH AND HEY DONT REALLY CARE WHAT I AM THOUGHT OF HERE.  SEEMS THAT MAINLY 3 OR 4 PEOPLE ARE STILL ARGUING ABOUT FORUM TOPIC MODERATING WHICH I HAVE NO INTEREST IN TO BE HONEST BUT REALLY IF YOU KEEP ARGUING AND NOTHING REALLY GETS ACCOMPLISHED NOW DOES IT.  JUST GROW A THICK SKIN AND IGNORE THE POST THAT IRRITATE YOU IF YOU KEEP RESPONDING TO THEM IT JUST ENCOURAGES THEM.  WITH THAT SAID BACK TO THE OTHER PART OF THIS TOPIC IN USER ROOM MODERATION I SAY YES.  NOTHING MORE IRRITATING THAN BEING A IN A ROOM WITH SPECIFIC THEME BY THE DESIGNER AND SOME STUCK UP BITCH OR BASTARD IGNORES IT BUT STAYS THERE FOR WAY TO LONG.  FOR EXAMPLE THE SIMPLE ROOMS OF COLDS ONLY IF YOUR NOT GOING TO CAPITULATE FINE LOOK AROUND FOR A FEW THEN GET OUT.  OR THE OPPOSITE IF ITS STATES JUST A CHAT ROOM NO SEX DONT HIT ON EVERYONE, ONCE AGAIN LOOK AROUND FOR A FEW MINUTES THEN GET THE FUCK OUT.  HOWEVER SOME DONT DO THAT, MIGHT BE ITS A ROOM REALLY FULL OF PEOPLE AND NOT MUCH GOING ON IN THE OTHER ROOMS.  WELL TO BAD IF YOU DONT LIKE THE THEME THATS NOT THE PROBLEM OF THE ROOM OWNER.  SEEMS A SIMPLE THING TO ME. 

[Guest Ciera]

@Mulan - Your point is?

 

I'm going to approach the 'what is the purpose of the forums thing' from a different angle today. Once again I hope to demonstrate that the behaviour of certain people on these forums is doing a grave disservice to Gizmo's attempts to build a business.

 

Before we first signed up to 3dx we wanted to know if we were going to get value for money, whether it would be any good, whatever our own definition of being any good is. We possibley stumbled on it by accident,as I did. We may have been redirected from a review site - which ever. Our first impresssions were gleaned from the 3dx web-site, maybe the forums. In short the forums provide information to poptential users about the product before they sign up for quite an expensive piece of software. I can only speak for myself but the rubbish on the forums meant that I only signed up for a month. Expensive yes, but it meant that if it didn't work for me then I could get out quick and minimise my losses. As it happenned, despite the shortcomings of the game as a sex game, I continued my sub. Basically because I met some ace people who I really enjoyed hanging out with. The sex, for me was an irrrelevance. I tried it, found it was crap (with one notable exception) and gave up with it.

 

So the point I'm making is that people make decisions off the back of the information they have. The forums are one of the sources of information. It is in the devs best interests to create the best first impression they can. Do the activities of certain people round here do this ............................... I defy anybody to suggest that, not just, RobT's inane drivel does anything to improve peoples first impressions of the product.

 

I'll now take it a step further. The opinion seems to be that only about 10% of people who play as women actually are women. This is in keeping with some research that was done about SecondLife back in the day when I did that. It is reasonable to ask ourselves why so few women join, it's not because it's a sex game it because the information provided discourages women from joining. I suspect most women who join don't renew, why not? I think we've seen in these discussions good reasons why that is the case.

 

OK lets play with a few figures. So if 10% of people who play as women are women then 5% of the user base is female. 3dx user base is currently growing at maybe 5 to 10% a year. I wouldn't guess much more because many venues are empty and when crowded don't actually appear to be more crowded than when I first joined.

 

If the devs can successfully address the female market so that the gender balance reflects rl then the user base will have grown by something like 80% - OK you may disagree with my assumptions, you may disagree with my method which is at best an estimation. The point is quite simple - address the female market and a far greater rate of growth is possible than would otherwise be the case.

 

The devs may be brilliant coders, they may have put together a great product in comparison to the alternatives but they also have investors to pay, infrastructure to pay for, they have to pay for techie people to keep the infrarstructure going and then when all that's done to draw a salary. So i'd say that by failing to moderate the forums, or in game behaviour, effectively the devs are hitting themselves directly in the pocket.

[Briana]

WTF!?

[Desirea]

Trolling with memes is lame.

[TruthHurts]

@Mulan - Your point is?

 

I'm going to approach the 'what is the purpose of the forums thing' from a different angle today. Once again I hope to demonstrate that the behaviour of certain people on these forums is doing a grave disservice to Gizmo's attempts to build a business.

 

Before we first signed up to 3dx we wanted to know if we were going to get value for money, whether it would be any good, whatever our own definition of being any good is. We possibley stumbled on it by accident,as I did. We may have been redirected from a review site - which ever. Our first impresssions were gleaned from the 3dx web-site, maybe the forums. In short the forums provide information to poptential users about the product before they sign up for quite an expensive piece of software. I can only speak for myself but the rubbish on the forums meant that I only signed up for a month. Expensive yes, but it meant that if it didn't work for me then I could get out quick and minimise my losses. As it happenned, despite the shortcomings of the game as a sex game, I continued my sub. Basically because I met some ace people who I really enjoyed hanging out with. The sex, for me was an irrrelevance. I tried it, found it was crap (with one notable exception) and gave up with it.

 

So the point I'm making is that people make decisions off the back of the information they have. The forums are one of the sources of information. It is in the devs best interests to create the best first impression they can. Do the activities of certain people round here do this ............................... I defy anybody to suggest that, not just, RobT's inane drivel does anything to improve peoples first impressions of the product.

 

I'll now take it a step further. The opinion seems to be that only about 10% of people who play as women actually are women. This is in keeping with some research that was done about SecondLife back in the day when I did that. It is reasonable to ask ourselves why so few women join, it's not because it's a sex game it because the information provided discourages women from joining. I suspect most women who join don't renew, why not? I think we've seen in these discussions good reasons why that is the case.

 

OK lets play with a few figures. So if 10% of people who play as women are women then 5% of the user base is female. 3dx user base is currently growing at maybe 5 to 10% a year. I wouldn't guess much more because many venues are empty and when crowded don't actually appear to be more crowded than when I first joined.

 

If the devs can successfully address the female market so that the gender balance reflects rl then the user base will have grown by something like 80% - OK you may disagree with my assumptions, you may disagree with my method which is at best an estimation. The point is quite simple - address the female market and a far greater rate of growth is possible than would otherwise be the case.

 

The devs may be brilliant coders, they may have put together a great product in comparison to the alternatives but they also have investors to pay, infrastructure to pay for, they have to pay for techie people to keep the infrarstructure going and then when all that's done to draw a salary. So i'd say that by failing to moderate the forums, or in game behaviour, effectively the devs are hitting themselves directly in the pocket.

 

Have to disagree.

 

It may be wishful thinking that the 3dxchat brand will be somehow damaged by the moronic behaviour of some known players on this forum, but the fact is it won't be. There are literally thousands of active players in 3dxchat and new members almost certainly by the day. Many say they leave, many do, but inevitably an awful lot also return, strengthening the business model. Most new members, or those thinking about joining, won't spend ages reading the forum and realistically few, if any, will be deterred because of some slanging match here. Forum isn't exactly a TripAdvisor poor rating that will deter new customers.

 

You say you have made 'assumptions' and, given that you write this like a sort of academic essay, perhaps you could justify some of them. For instance:

 

'It is reasonable to ask ourselves why so few women join, it's not because it's a sex game it because the information provided discourages women from joining.' - what is your evidence for this other than a bit of guesswork?

 

Is it not the case that the game attracts men (mostly) because the vast majority of women are not driven by their sexual needs in the same way men are? No sexist intentions in that at all, its simply caveman-mentality. Yes, some women look at porn, some women have high sex drives, but I'm talking about majorities here and, as you say, 90% of players on 3dxchat are men (or something like that).

 

But to say that the developers' business is in 'grave' danger is unsubstantiated garbage, sorry.

 

Forum is full of self-centred, attention-seeking idiots with their heads stuck up their backsides (and I don't mean the player to whom I am replying here). I mean the well-known ones, the ones who deliberately trash discussions, who are generally anti-women and don't actually have a single intellectual thing to say amongst them.

 

But they won't harm 3dxchat, at least, not here.

[Briana]

Trolling with memes is lame.

You have nothing better to say than repeating always the same thing? Who is a lame here? okay yes, i see, you still have no real life connection...probably you have no life too?

[Guest Mulan]

i found it very entertaining, keep up the good work. here is a joke to lighten the mood....

 

As an airplane is about to crash, a female passenger jumps up frantically and announces, "If I'm going to die, I want to die feeling like a woman." She removes all her clothing and asks, "Is there someone on this plane who is man enough to make me feel like a woman?" A man stands up, removes his shirt and says, "Here, iron this!".

Didn’t you get the memo? Sexist jokes are only okay if they are directed at men.

 

Like this... oh wait, wrong way, and I posted a meme.

 

[Twiggy]

Tell me Mulan, when you play a girl in 3DXChat, do you do the ironing and make the sandwiches. ?

[Guest Mulan]

Yes I do. I make a mean sandwich.

[Zokora]

This is an amazing example of a forum post going off rail, starting with opinions, proceeding with blaming, accusations and allegations, and ending up with a gender war, maybe showing up, what some people think of the other gender beyond all political correctness and politeness.

In the end I guess it is the lack of respect which makes me draw back from the game and the forum, no matter if it is people colding, insulting or behaving rude in the game, or people spreading insults, and allegations in the forum.

 

Looking at this I would rather prefer some "neutral" moderator than allowing everyone to kick someone out of his forum post, this thread exactly shows the reason why I think this way. This shows the typical discussion culture of these times: rather devalue the other one than talking about opinions and respecting the opinions of others and the others as well. And these are all opinions, no one has the claim for truth, so what makes it so important to be right, that some are willing to fight for this until the bitter end?

[MeiLing]

@ Zokora maybe focus on close friends and ignore the drama bearers is the solution

[Sage Stoner]

In the end I guess it is the lack of respect which makes me draw back from the game and the forum

 

There is a saying in Japanese: 魚は頭から腐る (sakana wa  atama kara kusaru)

 

Fish rot from the head.

 

I've said it before and I will say it again. How long are you going to let this bullshit go on, Gizmo? 

[Guest Ciera]

Well said Zokora, and Mei you do have a point which can work for a while. There is a limit. I don’t think I am alone in being very close to my limit. The sub is a lot of money to pay to have to deal with the kind of crap I deal with less of for free in rl.

 

What kind of impression do these forums create for potential users? What sort of people are likely to think 3dx is great based on what they see here?

[Leeloo]

i found it very entertaining, keep up the good work. here is a joke to lighten the mood....

 

As an airplane is about to crash, a female passenger jumps up frantically and announces, "If I'm going to die, I want to die feeling like a woman." She removes all her clothing and asks, "Is there someone on this plane who is man enough to make me feel like a woman?" A man stands up, removes his shirt and says, "Here, iron this!".

Hmmm ... i don't understand...