a warning for a dangerous place

[Guest Charly]

always first your real life!
then 3DX
and never mix the two lives.
As soon as you realize that you have a problem in 3DX, take a break.
One day, one week, one month.
always first your real life!

[Cordelia]

alisonn said...

seems a lot of people agreed, and a a few don't

Even the forum, which is almost totally divorced from the game itself, as far as number and type of persons is concerned, doesn't reflect what you say.
 

the story i have posted, is not a thing that happened to myself

ahhh... and my responses get dismissed by some, despite it having  happened to me, just because I approach life in a different way.

MeiLing said...

Btw, a lack of empathy cripples you here and in real life

That's a bit over the top. Sympathy is something anyone can have. Empathy has to be earned so, unless you have experienced something similar, you can only have a lack of empathy.

I rarely talk about it but game addiction (Everquest) and the consequences have affected my life significantly but I still maintain that it is just a game.

 

[Guest Ciera]

I'm unable to think of an opening statement that draws together the previous threads that I want to pick up on. The Internet, on-line games and social media are great enablers. It enables people of nearly all abilities to interact as equals, it removes many of the barriers of race, religion and culture. So far so good that's great, yeah. It probably why we're here doing 3dx and the like. It also enables the wankers to be total wankers, so a certain responsibility is imposed on us, the users. OMG this is starting to sound a bit like a degree thesis, it's not intended that way, just trying to get my thoughts together without doing the first draft, second draft thing.

 

It may be a pious hope, as Rob suggests and I intmated, to expect people to behave responsibley. They don't, and the anonymity of 3dx and its ilk mean the idiots think they can get away with it, and they mostly do. What I take issue with is that it should be fair to assume that people will behave according to basic good manners, taking account of the fact that 3dx is a melting pot of cultures and that we, as sensible adults are prepared to do our little bit to deal with those who chose not to. It is a choice too, these people wouldn't say the stuff they do to their boss, work colleagues etc. Although in the case of most of the people causing the trouble it'd be teachers they wouldn't say this stuff to.  It is NOT, however, the victims' fault if they get trolled, verbally abused or whatever. It is the abusers fault. OK these people reappear with monotonous regularity so a few basic steps to protect yourself are sensible. When someone says they have been trolled it does not help if someone says to them did you do this, did you do that. All that does is increases the sense that they have done something wrong. Is it not better to let them talk it through, if you can? The way you behave reflects who you are. OK you can behave like a twat when not meaning to, that's OK and most people when they do apologise. That is very different from people deliberately behaving like total arses.

 

Here's a quote from Melanie Reid's column in today's Times that sums it up for me, albeit not a direct analogy.

 

"May I have a final word on Roy Moore, the defeated Republican candidate in Alabama - still refusing to concede, incidently - who was filmed riding to the polls on a benighted skewbald horse. A man who hauls a horse around by the bit as he did, using brute force on its mouth, reveals everything about himself. He's not just a loser, he's a low-calibre human being."

[Guest Lillyme]

The thing that gets me most in all these topics is that the same old argument comes out...”It is what it is...deal with it”

 

I hate that...that’s basically like saying give up on making anything better. All it takes is enough people of like mind to make cultural shifts...and some of the things we’ve been talking about...promoting in these threads are for the betterment of all. The internet is still nascent in how it handles and understands these issues...and we’ll probably find more and more blurring with the “real” world, (which is a subjective term anyway) so...sooner or later the behaviour we consider desirable in the real world wil have to become culturally enforced online to. I’m not talking about Gizmo making rules for it all...which seems to be what everyone jumps to as an excuse...”if it’s not in the ToS I can do what I want”...society has a million things that aren’t enforced literally but are culturally.

 

The fact that people see any online forum (in the true sense of the word) as an excuse to say what they like how they like...do what they want...treat any other human how they want...is mostly because of perceived anonymity and lack of consequence to those actions. Even just looking at how some people speak to each other in here...in reality they never would face to face.

 

I agree there’s a certain amount of people being snowflakes...and if you’re seriously struggling with issues irl I would say 3dx is the -last- place you should be but...that’s because of the culture thats formed here...doesn’t mean it’s the only way it can be.

 

If you treat people here how you would in real life...and how you would also wish to be treated...I think we’d all be happier. Having said that the people to avoid are mostly obvious if you pay attention.

[alisonn]

That's a bit over the top. Sympathy is something anyone can have. Empathy has to be earned so, unless you have experienced something similar, you can only have a lack of empathy.

a person with a mindset like this on a forum post like mine can and should always be tsken with a grain of salt.

or perhaps a hand full of it.

 

what a horrible way to think.

[MeiLing]

nope Cordelia is a good person. I have chatted with her in the game. You can be sure that she is kind. I understand what she means, even if I disagree with her. She missed the point that for a lot of peoples, it is more than a game, it is a social network, and it has consequences. If you came to a nervous, mental breakdown one solution: RUN AWAY.

[alisonn]

never said she's a bad person.

just a bad mentality.

[alisonn]

If you treat people here how you would in real life...and how you would also wish to be treated...I think we’d all be happier.

this is something i agree with completely, yet it's also the thing That makes it even more dangerous.

 

i.m.o. these "trolls" are not as much the issue.

poisonous people can be evaded simply eith an ignore button and solved quite easily.

but it's the people that latch on to you, make you feel and believe they care for you and see you as their best friend that can cause the real damage.

of course not everyone will hurt you and not everyone is a bad choice of friend.

but there are those few that make you love everything about them, and in the end leave you with nothing at all.

 

if i need to pick an example i can tell you something that happened to me....in a very small nutshell.

 

i loved my best friend, and my best friend was chasing someone else.

she stopped chasing her, and eventually told me that we would be together.

after weeks of keeping it low, we finally got together, making me the happiest person alive.

3 days later i got dumped, she told me she still loved the other person, and never even loved me at all.

she proceeded to, not talk to me.

push me back as "just a friend" instead of best friend.

lied to me about never getting in a relationship again in 3dx Because she is now with someone else.

all while she was engaged irl and married her bf a few days ago.

and just so much more i don't want to explain "again".

 

these are people that don't take in to account that they might be seriously affecting someone's life and Messing things up really badly for them.

but in their mind, they did nothing wrong, or it were "just a few mistakes".

though the person at the other side is becoming depressed or stressed or ill or even suicidal.

 

the problem lies in people understanding that this place needs to be taken very seriously and with caution.

if you don't but make promises such as love and true friendship, things are going to turn out very badly.

maybe not so much for thst person, but for the people that person hangs around with.

 

 

my original statement stands.

be careful, treat it with caution, and if you need help, Don't be afraid to ask

[Guest Lillyme]

Hmm...there’s a whole load of things to look at there alisonn but in principle you are right...life in general teaches you from a very early age to go into every relationship with armour up right? Now I know 3dx is a microcosm...things that develop over weeks and months and years in rl seem to happen in a few days or weeks here...

 

People are married and posting how much they love each other one week and with someone else the next...maybe that’s the nature of the game...certainly not how i’ve “Played” It though so it all depends on what you bring to it and how honest you are with each other. I’ve made mistakes sure but never have I been unaware of how those can affect real people behind the avi’s.

 

You also learn how to read which are your real friends in life...they are the ones that are still there when there’s nothing to gain from you...still there when you’re being your worst and holding your hand to help you back.

 

I don’t wanna comment on the specifics of your situation because I don’t know either of you well enough to pass judgement lol...joking...but yeah you do need to realise fast here that some play it as a game and some don’t. As long as everyone is clear who is doing what all is well...fires burn strangely hot and fast here so equally you can get burned easier.

[Cordelia]

alisonn said...

 

 

a person with a mindset like this on a forum post like mine can and should always be tsken with a grain of salt.
or perhaps a hand full of it.

what a horrible way to think.

 

Perhaps you didn't understand my post. You can research the meaning of the words "sympathy" and "empathy" if you like.

Many people do use the latter erroneously.

 

I'll repeat, rephrasing it and I hope it helps you understand...

We can all offer sympathy but offering empathy implies that you have been through the same or similar circumstance.

 

MeiLing (whom I have a lot of respect for) said "Btw, a lack of empathy cripples you here and in real life."

Perhaps she meant "sympathy." I won't put words in her mouth.

A lack of empathy only means that you are not capable of expressing it due to not having been in the same or similar situation.

 

Before you criticize people try and understand what they are actually saying.

[Guest Harmony]

 

That's a bit over the top. Sympathy is something anyone can have. Empathy has to be earned so, unless you have experienced something similar, you can only have a lack of empathy.

 

 

I think I get what Cordelia means here - that we can all sympathise with people who are in need (well, most humans can, there are one or two people on forum who I doubt they have the capacity to do so but that's another story). But unless you have actually experienced something personally, it's difficult to empathise because empathy needs that extra layer of experience.

 

So I can absolutely empathise with anyone that has suffered from depression and felt suicidal, but I can only sympathise with someone who has lost a child for example.

 

However, my earlier point in this thread is that I would hope that we can all be sensitive to those with mental health issues (again, I'm not referring to the OP here, but making a general point that I arrived at through my thinking) and accept that it is not so easy to say 'oh they should just pull themselves together and leave the game' because it becomes all-consuming and some people do not have the rational thought processes, through no fault of their own, to make those sort of conscious decisions.

 

Understanding players from all walks of life requires sensitivity and sympathy - empathy is not always needed. Being judgemental is counter-productive.

 

Sorry to bang on about this theme but it's one I feel strongly about. I live in a country where if you're mentally ill, poor, elderly, homeless or uneducated, you get treated like shit by the establishment. I live in one of the most unequal developed nations on Earth and sometimes the inequality - that is happening to other people, not to me - gets me down.

[Sage Stoner]

Perhaps you didn't understand my post. You can research the meaning of the words "sympathy" and "empathy" if you like.

Many people do use the latter erroneously.

 

We can all offer sympathy but offering empathy implies that you have been through the same or similar circumstance.

 

Well, according to Merriam-Webster, you are wrong. There is nothing in the definition of empathy that implies you have to have had a similar experience.

 

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/empathy 

Empathy is . . . the action of understanding, being aware of, being sensitive to, and vicariously experiencing the feelings, thoughts, and experience of another . . .

 

https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/sympathy-empathy-difference

The difference in meaning is usually explained with some variation of the following: sympathy is when you share the feelings of another; empathy is when you understand the feelings of another but do not necessarily share them.

 

[alisonn]

 

Before you criticize people try and understand what they are actually saying.

i understood quite​ well what you said.

still a horrible way to think.

but now you're judging at random​.

i won't reply to you anymore, you seem...too cold.

[alisonn]

 

I live in a country where if you're mentally ill, poor, elderly, homeless or uneducated, you get treated like shit by the establishment.

aye i live in a country where this happens often as well sadly.

it even starts to feel like my entire country is becoming more and more cold by the day, and the value of a person seems to diminish as we grow more attached to our technology and individuality proceeds to grow.

 

i hope as we grow older we start to realize the value humanity again, Because at this point i feel like we live in a cold dead planet.

[alisonn]

Now I know 3dx is a microcosm...things that develop over weeks and months and years in rl seem to happen in a few days or weeks here...

 

it's true.

and i think a lot is owed to the fact that people crave love so much that a lot of it isn't formed from feeling for one another but for the craving of being in a relationship.

that's a very unhealthy way to start a relationship even though it might be a subconscious thing.

 

that and the fact that we all share a common Purpose when we go to 3DX. it's not only two gain intimacy but it's to socialise and to make your desires come true. are sharing that seem purpose makes it really easy for you to talk and to share your thoughts.

 

and also there is simply no consequences in this place. you can pretty much do anything without being physically hurt without being fined or anything of the sort. you can pretty much do anything you want. it makes you think less of your actions.

but that's all just opinion.

[Cordelia]

alisonn said...

 

 

i understood quite​ well what you said.
still a horrible way to think.
but now you're judging at random​.
i won't reply to you anymore, you seem...too cold.

 

It is people like you that are the problem with the game (any game). That don't play it as it was designed. Then when things go wrong with your life (oh, it actually wasn't your life, it was a piece of fiction about someone else) you blame the game. You can't understand why people don't fawn over you and share your opinions about what is only a game and you call them names and "judge them at random."

If you had bothered to read what I have posted you would a) know that I sympathized with you and b ) that I could possibly empathize with you as someone like the person in your story, who couldn't understand that it was only a game, fucked up my life, but I have got over it.

Who cares whether you reply or not. I really don't want to wade through shit grammar, punctuation and spelling anyway.

[Guest Harmony]

Can I appeal to people’s kinder nature to ask to please stop the belittling and criticism that’s started on this thread.

 

It’s a serious topic that Alisonn was right to raise and it’s prompted some important discussion.

 

Slating each other isnt going to be useful.

[Guest Ciera]

If I asked how many people here have been taken for a fool by someone here and got hurt you'd prolly get just as many hands go up as in rl, yeah. Does that make rl a bad place? No it doesn't.

 

I think I'm just about to repeat stuff that's gone before, but wtf. What do you do about these evil shites? You could grow a carapace so thick that no-one's going to hurt you ever again. That is such a good idea, like yeah you miss out on so much and prolly become pretty insensitive to people. Most of us try and find a working compromise and check people out a little before diving in. It means you get hurt less often, but it still happens. This doesn't work so well on-line, like there's not so much info to go on. You can only go on what people say. Normal people make some sort of allowances for this and we all get on OK. There are some sad bastards messing it up for everybody by taking advantage of this. It is not their victim's fault if they get hurt, so saying 'it's what it is, get over it' is sooooo helpful and makes you feel soooo much better ........................ not.

 

OMG if you have a friend who's been messed up by some arse what's so hard about doing what friends do rl, and being there for them? You can't totally avoid getting hurt but it doesn't have to be quite so awful. BTW - I see what people do in Alisonn's scenario as another form of trolling.

[alisonn]

. BTW - I see what people do in Alisonn's scenario as another form of trolling.

what do you mean by this exactly?

Because the post sure isn't trolling or trying to troll anyone.

it's there to warn people, and send out a message to people that if they ever need help, they, tbey shouldn't wait.

I'm really trying to let people know that if they have any issues and need to talk, i'm always an option.

 

i could have misunderstood what you said though​, so don't feel attacked, I don't intend it as such.

[Guest Ciera]

Sorry, I thought the context would make it clear.

 

To my mind deliberately building up peoples' of a relationship and then dumping them is just another form of trolling. That's an instant summary of how I read your scenario. I know people do it rl but you get a whole lot of other iformation which helps avoid gettign hurt. I think the people who deliberately do it in game are basically taking advantage,

 

I hope that explains what I was getting at, yeah.

[alisonn]

well i hope i wasn't trolled but it damn sure feels like I've been played and used.

but that's not a topic i'd like to discuss here

 

it's hard to truly judge someone's intentions through mere text.

emotions can't be read through them.

so it's equally as easy to misinterpreted words and someone's​ intentions at it is to misjudge someone.

it's sad, but it's just how it is.

and in the end, having no consequences makes the weaker minded people do unfair and brutal things.

like promising love, sending out personal information, insulting or anything of the sort.

it's why 3dx can be dangerous not only emotionally, but also for your own personal safety, because there are some crazy people out there with menacing intentions.

it why it just needs a warning sign.

that's enough to keep people aware i hope.

 

also i'm kinda drunk atm, so maybe i'm just blabbing nonsense and not understanding your words >.>

[Guest Ciera]

You're doing OK, hun. /me gets herself another glass of aussie shiraz.

[alisonn]

/me finishes her bottle of wine and goes to bed >.>

[YouAreMySpecial]

I'm a bit on the middle ground when it comes to this. Cordelia has some good points for sure, but let's think about it this way.

 

We're in a virtual environment where everyone can be whatever they damned please to be. Even if it doesn't match up to their real selves, right?

 

That's why there is so much deceit and lying going on. People are unaware of RL and mental consequences for fucking other people over. I believe your mine has got to be detoriating when you enjoy making people feel bad this way.

 

But when it comes to "coldness" and empathy I've not been so great with that either. Mainly because I was raised to be stoic, and the negative experiences on 3dx such as people threatening to kill themselves over me/to get attention. It takes a while for me to get out of my shell fully, but that's what is keeping my disattached from feeling too much.

 

For the people who have been seriously hurt by a game like this before, I can understand you. But you'll find the best way is to take breaks/ not let yourself get too attached to some people. I've made this mistake before too and it badly burned me. Some internet people are just their to make things worse for everyone..even though they don't have a reason to.

[Guest Ciera]

/me thinks Henkie uses a pic of Slash for a reason. all hail the man's man. I have this theory that the stuff sticking out from under Slash's hat is not really hair at all but comes off at night with the hat.

 

Has RobT given up on women because he's been dumped a few times?